Q1. Evacuating Jerusalem

[tammie7]

Daivid flee because he know that he need a strategic, you also needs months of

food and supplies and military was weak.His emtions was a repent mode,He don't

take the Art because if the lord wanted him to see the Art again he wuld let him

go back to the town.It show how he had faith the the God that he worship would

get him back to be king.

[Lorraine Overstreet]

Q1. (2 Samuel 15:14-30)

Why does David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight?

What are David’s emotions during this retreat?

Why doesn’t he take the ark with him into exile?

Does this exhibit faith, fatalism, or submission?

What does this tell us about his faith?

A) David fled Jerusalem for several reasons: He loved Israel and did not

want his people to die, Lack of food and supplies to withstand a long liege.

Military weakness, David had troops, but not access to the number Absalom

had, and David knew the value of a strategic retreat.

David is heartbroken and realized he had been self absorbed for years.

This crisis forces him to look to the welfare of his people. (another reason

for the retreat)

c) David told Zadok to take the Ark back to the city. He thought if he found

favor in the Lor's eyes, he would bring David back to Israel.

d) David's attitude clearly was one of submission to Yahweh. He was

barefoot, weeping and had his head covered. He knew this was part of

God's punishment for his sins. His faith in God's will was Strong.

e) David said "let Him do to me whatever seems good to Him", and David

meant it. This shows very strong faith in God's will.

[royk]

Q1. (2 Samuel 15:14-30) Why does David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight?

What are David's emotions during this retreat? Why doesn't he take the ark with him into exile? Does this exhibit faith, fatalism, or submission? What does this tell us about his faith?

David understands he is caught unaware, and that this fulfills a prophesy due to his sins. So he shows concern for the people who are with him and for the city itself, that it not be destroyed in a fight. Better late than never, he is showing his experience and his acceptance of his fate. But he has not surrendered all to his son, but he has surrendered all to his Lord. He leaves the ark, trusting God's decision on his future life as a man and possibly as a king. His dress and posture is showing his submission and humility.

[wifee]

1a)David wasn’t aware that Absalom was building an army to take Jerusalem,so he did not have a stock pile of food&provisions necessary for probable tough battle,he also knew his troops in Jerusalem were less in number,meaning he would lose a battle against larger nos of troops from across kingdom Absalom had access to,so David planned a tacticle retreat,to avoid bloodshed of his men&family.
b)David is thinking Absalom’s men Israelites will not harm his10concubines left behind &thinks he will return to city.He is in despair,he realises Absalom’s threat is because of his sins,&he is deeply repentant.He believe’s the Ark belongs in the capital City as Yahweh is Israel’s God,& he has faith that he knows the LORD is with him whether he has Ark with him or not, so asks through tears of grief for Ark to go back to City.
c)This exhibits faith in the LORD believing unseen God is merciful and still with him without visible presence of Ark.Going barefoot exhibits humble posture &submission to God’s will,&demonstrating trust in God whether Ark is brought back to him or not&deter from current judgement.David is also able to use Zadock’s eyes,sending him a report to see what David is doing in city.
d)Tells us his faith was strong&also his strategic ability too.

[cjenkins1388]

David is much older now and it's been so long since he has had to fight that he has let his military come down to the minimum and his resources are weak.

 

It's like that with us still today once we get comfortable in what we have fought so hard to get, marriage, children, careers etc. we don't prepare for anything to change.  When it does we panic and then turn back to God for help and that is when we realize that we have been complacent and not actively living as God may have wanted us to.

 

I think David is scared, because he feels like he deserves this to happen based on his own sins and the prophesy from Nathan.

 

David doesn't take the ark with him because God doesn't belong just to him.  And he has faith that God will do His will based on whatever David deserves.  David is ready to take whatever it is that God does for him.

 

David's faith in God is strong and commendable, it is his own human nature that is not.

[webster52]

Why does David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight? It is a strategic retreat. . David had no advance notice of Absalom's coup; there is no stock of food, which means that it is inevitable that Jerusalem will fall to Absalom.  His current military weakness would have all but insured his small army’s defeat and massive loss of life.  He was showing concern for the people of Jerusalem.

 

What are David's emotions during this retreat? I believe David experienced a plethora of emotions. He was undoubtedly shocked and perplexed at this attack/overthrow after twenty years of peace. He had a deep concern/fear for the welfare of the people of Jerusalem. He was probably having feelings of guilt, disgust, even anger for himself having been self-absorbed for years and allowing this coup to happen. Having your own son take arms against you had to evoke a profound pain /anguish in his heart. Extreme sadness is an absolute. Yet through all of these emotions he was repentant toward the LORD, strong in faith, and strategic in his thinking.

 

Why doesn't he take the ark with him into exile? Verse 15:25 gives us the explanation and David’s mindset: “Take the ark of God back into the city. If I find favor in the LORD's eyes, He will bring me back and let me see it and His dwelling place again.”  It is with satisfaction and submission David speaks of the Divine disposal. It is in our interest, as well as our duty,  to cheerfully acquiesce to the will of God, whatever our circumstance may be.

 

Does this exhibit faith, fatalism, or submission? It is Faith most definitely.

 

What does this tell us about his faith? David trusted in God, not in the Ark of the Covenant. He was willing to let the ark go back to Jerusalem and to put his fate in God's hands. His humbled and chastened spirit proved he knew God dealt with him righteously. David submitted to God with an active submission, not a passive one.

 

[karynjg]

(2 Samuel 15:14-30) Why does David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight? What are David's emotions during this retreat? Why doesn't he take the ark with him into exile? Does this exhibit faith, fatalism, or submission? What does this tell us about his faith?

 

I would not have known from the verse that David's city is not prepared for a siege, but appears he has a pretty good idea of how quickly he must act.  Since he is not stocked up, he chooses to flee to save lives.  He is heartbroken at having to do this.  He leaves the ark because he believes it is for the people to worship Yahweh and belongs with in Jerusalem; it is not just for himself. He seems to be a man who is accepting his punishment from God for his past sins, so he is repentant and humbled.  This shows both faith in God's sovereignty as well as submission to that authority.

[Zibuyile]

1.Why David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight? He feared being attacked by  Absolom , if they stay they will suffer hungry as the didn't  have enough time to collect stock of food

2.What are David's emotions  during this retreat?

Food supplies was going to be a problem,  Weak military  ,not enough  shoulders to fight Absolom

3.Why doesn't  he take the ark with him?

He realised that what is happening was God's  discipline  as was prophesied by Nathan, believed  God will forgive him if he dies right even without  the ark being with  him 

4.Does this exhibit  faith or fatalism or submission? Exhibit submission

5.What does this tell us about his faith?

That David hasn't lost faith in God, will still forgive him for his wrong doings 

 

[Irmela]

Q1. (2 Samuel 15:14-30)

Why does David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight?

What are David's emotions during this retreat?

Why doesn't he take the ark with him into exile?

Does this exhibit faith, fatalism, or submission?

What does this tell us about his faith?

David didn't have time to make preparations to hold Jerusalem. There were no extra food supplies, which would have been necessary for a siege. David's professional mercenary troops -- Kerethites, Pelethites, and Gittites -- were with him in Jerusalem, but their numbers were very small compared to the national militia Absalom had access to,  tens of thousands of Israelites from all over the kingdom. Not only were the food and man-power a problem, but also, Absalom's forces entered the city from the south about the time the last of David's supporters were leaving to the east. There was no time to waste.   David knew the value of a strategic retreat.  If he would have stayed to fight there would have been much blood shed.  He was trying to avoid this at all cost.  He basically had no choice. 

David is extremely hurt by his son's actions.  If it was someone else it would be different, but the son whom he had received back home after he had plotted the murder of his first-born.  It seemed extra wrong somehow.  But David also accepts it as his punishment, so he is submissive to Yahweh.  In this whole incident of the move one sees that David remains humble, repentant and submissive.  His thinking involves the people that are fleeing with him, whose safety is uppermost in his mind.  BUT he also thinks of his people on the other side who are blinded. He does not wish a civil-war.  All this being the fruit of his sin.  He had been forgiven, but the consequences were now in full bloom.  

David knows that the Lord is with him, whether or not he has the ark of the covenant in his procession. It belongs, he believes, in the capital city. Yahweh is Israel's God. The ark is not David's personal shrine to take with him wherever he goes.  

Through his tears and his mourning and his repentance, this is the faith-filled, obedient David we see.  His faith is strong.  He is thinking ahead in spite of the circumstances.  He is fulfilling the leadership role, as the David of long ago when he needed to take care of his troops and followers when they were fleeing from Saul.  He does trust that the Lord will do what is just and he submits to that.  

[Krissi]

David is one of those people who thrive in times of conflict, rises to the occasion and shines as a leader. It's only during times of boredom and normalcy that David has moral problems. Thankfully, this is a time of conflict. Yes, David is morose and humble before God, but that's the pattern of his behavior -- when things get bad, David prostrates himself before God. 

Returning the ark is an interesting act. It's classic David -- all or nothing. Either the ark "defends" David, in an odd sense, or it turns against David -- (the God behind the ark, that is).  David is fleecing God. He's trying to force God's hand into either defending or abandoning him.

I agree that this is a strategic defeat. It was also unnecessary. Had David not been cloistered in his castle, he would have known what the people were thinking and hearing. A populist movement had arisen as he looked the other way. So, David didn't have his ear to the ground. He was blindsided. Better retreat, think and then fight than enter into a fray for which he was unprepared. David withdrew to "live again to fight another day." 

I'm trying to think of a contemporary parallel to this and all I can think of is the Russian withdrawal from Kherson in 2023? below some sort of waterway, and how the Western media crowed and jeered Russia's "inevitable defeat." But Russian leaders kept their focus. They didn't listen to the jeering Westerners. They withdrew to buy time and snooker the Ukrainians into sending people into a nearby town of Krinky. Thousands of Ukrainian men were lured to their death there, believing the propaganda that Russia had been fatally weakened. In the meantime, R waited as it strategically planned it's next move. David's situation is like this. Yes, the Absalom coup was a PR disaster but it was also an occasion where David could rise to lead. During this time, David showed an ability to look ahead and see future steps to victory.

David's faith, like ours, is strengthened during times of adversity. God puts us into situations in which we have to cling to him for mere survival. He tests us. He makes us suffer. He does all this to strengthen us so we're prepared for whatever he has in front of us to do. Every big calling requires a long period of preparation and suffering. David's "calling" was to restore Israel and get rid of the bad son. To do this, he had to be in lockstep with God's will. I believe David obeyed God at this time.

 

 

 

[Nicolaas A.P. Mostert]

Q1. (2 Samuel 15:14-30)

Why does David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight?

David's immediate challenges are two-fold:

Food and supplies. To survive a siege, a city must stock up with food and military supplies to last for many months. If they don't, they'll be starved out. David has had no advance notice of Absalom's coup. There is no stock of food, which means that it is inevitable that Jerusalem will fall to Absalom -- and soon! This assumes that Jerusalem's fortifications are not under construction or in disrepair. There hasn't been a military threat to the city in more than twenty years.

Military weakness. David's professional mercenary troops -- Kerethites, Pelethites, and Gittites -- are with him in Jerusalem. And they are a fierce fighting force! But their numbers are very small compared to the national militia Absalom has access to, which can draw on tens of thousands of Israelites from all over the kingdom.

This crisis forces him to look to the welfare of his people

What are David's emotions during this retreat?

David's attitude was one of submission to Yahweh

Why doesn't he take the ark with him into exile?

The ark is not David's personal shrine to take with him wherever he goes.

Does this exhibit faith, fatalism, or submission?

Through his tears and his mourning and his repentance, this is the faith-filled, obedient David we see.

What does this tell us about his faith?

Through his tears and his mourning and his repentance, this is the faith-filled, obedient David we see.

[LadyT]

Q1. (2 Samuel 15:14-30) Why does David flee Jerusalem rather than stay and fight? Ill-prepared for a fight and it's better to not let the city experience a civil war.

What are David's emotions during this retreat? Being faithful and courageous as well as repenting and accepting his discipline.

Why doesn't he take the ark with him into exile? God "belongs" to Israel, not David

Does this exhibit faith, fatalism, or submission? Faith and submission. 

What does this tell us about his faith? It's still unwavering.