Q2. Forgiveness and Obedience

[sunshine-lady]

Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works?

 

Forgiveness requires us to turn away from sin and make a great effort to do what is good and right! And to do that we must be obedient to God's law.  We continually fall short of God's law and seek his forgiveness but to truly be sorry for sin there must be a change of heart and behavior and this can only be possible if we are committed to obeying God. No amount of work can pay for our redemption. We are saved by God's grace which was freely given while we were still in a state of sin. 

[Adeola]

On 23/01/2004 at 2:14 AM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10)

Forgiveness (sprinkling ) and obedience come together as a package because you can't have one without the other. 

Hebrew 9:22 And according to the Law, one may almost say, all things are cleansed with blood, and without shedding of blood there is no forgiveness.

Forgiveness has been purchased for us by Christ, accepting the call (obedience ) by believing the gift of forgiveness that leads to salvation is very paramount . For the bible says in Romans 10:10 we believe with our hearts unto righteousness  and confess with our mouth unto salvation. Without Obeying the call, we are rejecting the very thing that will bring us salvation. If there is no forgiveness on the other hand nothing to obey. They are definitely a package , thinking otherwise is  a delusion.

True faith requires obedience but this obedience is not of works but the yielding of the heart. Our heart cannot be yielded if we were first not chosen by God for salvation. For a person who has been pre-destined to be saved cannot take credit for their salvation . The bible says 1 Cor 3:7 that it is neither the sower nor the one who waters that is anything but God who brings the increase. Therefore, it is by Gods grace that we were first elected, predestined to inherit salvation and the planting of the seed in our hearts and the process until when it was ripe for reaping is not of our on works  but all by His grace. True Faith is believing all of the above and yielding our hearts in obedience.

[Tinynedl]

Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10)

Forgiveness is followed by obedience because of gratefulness. Forgiveness without obedience would reflect a lack of accountability, and obedience without forgiveness might show a sense of 'victimization'.

 

[charisbarak]

The fact that we are forgiven, opens the way for us to obey. We wouldn't expect an unsaved person to obey God.

Good works were set out for us to do as a result of being saved----we are not saved by works.  Salvation comes first.  And as James wrote--faith without works is dead.  Those works prove salvation & a changed life.

[Ganti Vivek]

Forgiveness and obedience come together because in obedience we listen and follow instructions and abide by them that is what our Lord has said to us to do, by this we are forgiven of all our sins by His grace which is free, but the important thing here is that we stop sinning again and again and keep seeking forgiveness again and again making the grace cheap and insulting our Lord in front of the gentile by our unholy living and calling ourselves Christians.

But we are saved purely by His grace through faith in Him and not by any good works we do, but once saved we are supposed to show our faith through our works and deeds, otherwise our faith without works is dead.

[Vangogh357]

On 1/22/2004 at 8:14 PM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10)

"Obedience" demonstrates that we have received wholeheartedly the power of "forgiveness". Obedience shows that we take God's forgiveness and king JESUS' sacrifice very  seriously. To assume to just receive God's forgiveness and not obeying JESUS' teachings. I'm convinced by scripture and Holy Spirit influence and guidance that it is God's grace and not my works that saved me, but works (working for God to show love and mercy to all mankind) is important and have more meaning after God's amazing grace. I'm able to appreciate the works because I was saved.

[Commissioned]

Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10)

I feel forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package because they are a part of the sanctifying work if the Spirit.  We come to Christ in faith, the work of the Holy Spirit begins in us we are forgiven, the blood of Jesus cleansing us and the power to live a sanctified life through the empowering of the Spirit causes us to obey the commands and word of God.  It is deceptive to think that you can have one without the other because it is not solely dependent on our effort, it is the work of the Spirit of God.  True faith does require obedience,  It is our obedience through the grace given to us that we are saved.  (Almost liken the chicken and the egg. Which came first?)

 

[pcjames4]

On 1/22/2004 at 8:14 PM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q2. (1:2) Why do forgiveness (sprinkling) and obedience come together as a package? Why is it deceptive to think you can have one without the other? Extra credit: If true faith requires obedience, how can we say that we are saved by grace rather than works? (Ephesians 2:8-10)

Forgiveness and obedience come together as a package since the bridge between faith and practice is worship.  Since we have been forgiven, this gift of God requires a response of the recipient of such grace.  Our response to such an amazing act of love should be worship that leads to obedience.  We are not obedient to gain forgiveness, we are obedient because we are forgiven.  

Likewise, as it has been said before faith alone saves but the faith that saves is not alone.  It's only through God's grace that we are saved but the true test of that grace is the natural outworking and fruit that is yielded because of our salvation.  Works are always the response, not the cause of our salvation.  

[Paulhoward]

Forgiveness is part of discipleship. I need to practice obedience to further my discipleship. Yet by myself I need grace to energise my faith to make this possible.

[Krissi]

I cannot answer this question well . It's too weighty. Below is a pathetic attempt ...

I see forgiveness and obedience in chronological order. First, we try to obey. Since we inevitably sin and fall short, we're stuck in a self-aware and self-condemning mode. As we grow closer to Him, our awareness of sin grows. We're tormented by repetitive sins --things we say we shouldn't have said, for example, yet say again and again, even against our determination to do otherwise. We simply can't obey. Not consistently.

Now, I know there's a strain in Holiness theology which says perfection is possible and, given enough time, a Christian can actually live an hour without sinning. I don't subscribe to this. As I see it, sin permeates our body, soul and mind. It's a lifetime battle to rid ourselves of even a fraction of our sin, even with the indwelling Spirit and God's promise to help.

Thus, we need forgiveness. Forgiveness puts us back on the starting line. But, frankly, we need a lot more than forgiveness -- we need more of the Spirit within us. More and more. A bigger Spirit. We need to invite Him in to the nooks and crannies of our mind that need to be cleansed. But we don't even know where those nooks are! And forgiveness only covers what we ask to be forgiven. We ask to be forgiven of certain obvious sins. But there's so much we don't know. So many sins we've committed but have not confessed.

This is where grace comes in. I may be able to confess a few of my sins, but not most. God's grace allows me to struggle on. It covers the unknown sin, the tendency within to sin, and the deep urges to sin of which I'm blind. Grace is forgiveness unaware. 

My works -- even if they were all good, which they are not -- will not go far. I need grace to carry me to real and total forgiveness as well as to improve my character so that my works actually please Him.