Q2. Second Birth

[Isaac L]

On 7/24/2018 at 1:15 AM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q2. (John 3:1-8) When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit? What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?

Although Nicodemus was earnestly seeking the truth, I don't think he was born of the Spirit at this juncture. That's why Jesus chose to address this matter to him.

On a theological level and from God's perspective, the difference is the presence of the Holy Spirit who changes a born-again from the inside out. One who only experienced the first birth may even agree with the truths about God or be earnestly trying to live a good life - but all these efforts are his own, without the presence and help of the Holy Spirit.

On a practical level and from a human perspective, it is truly difficult to tell sometimes who has experienced the second birth and who has not.

[LissaR]

Nicodemus wasn't born of the Spirit when he came to visit Jesus because he didn't recognize Jesus as the Messiah and Savior.  He recognized Jesus as a teacher and Rabbi.  He recognized that Jesus was sent from God because the miracles that Jesus performed could not have taken place were God not with Him, but Nicodemus did not understand that Jesus came to save him (and mankind) from our sins.  His curiosity led him to seek out Jesus late at night when their meeting would be private (secret?).  He may not have recognized Jesus as Messiah, he may not have understood sin and our need of a Savior, but the Holy Spirit drew him to Jesus so that he could learn the Truth and ultimately be saved.

People who have only experienced the first birth don't recognize Jesus as the Savior of mankind.  They don't understand sin and their need of a Savior; they are spiritually dead.  It is through the hearing of the Gospel that they are drawn to Jesus, and they experience the second birth when they confess their sins and accept Jesus' forgiveness, declaring Him the Lord of their life.  After this second birth, the believer has power over sin that they previously did not have.  They have peace that passes all understanding.  They no longer fear death.  They have strength to face and endure suffering.  There is joy each day as they walk with Jesus and experience the presence of the Holy Spirit in their heart, guiding them each day.

 

[Rosesam]

Q2. (John 3:1-8) When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit? What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?

Nicodemus was a seeker of spiritual truth and he was intrigued by the ministry of Jesus. But I don’t think he was already born of the Spirit. For when Jesus said that to see and to enter the kingdom of God one must be born again, Nocodemus couldn’t understand what Jesus was saying. What Jesus meant is Kingdom of God is spiritually discerned and entrance into the Kingdom of God is only by invitation. Salvation is costly. It cost the death of His Son. This side of eternity we may never know how much it cost for Him to pay the price of my sin. But only by the quickening of His Spirit, we will be able to spiritually discern and it is the Holy Spirit that baptizes us into His body thus allowing us entrance into His kingdom. Nicodemus indeed experienced salvation later on, as evidenced by his conduct when Jesus was buried after His crucifixion.

Those who experienced the second birth will not experience the second death which is destined for all whose name is not written in the Lamb’s Book of Life. But those who have only experienced the first birth wiill experience the second death. So, a person who has experienced the second birth will receive eternal life, whereas the one who has experienced only the first birth will receive death.

[av4Jesus]

On 7/23/2018 at 9:15 PM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q2. (John 3:1-8) When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit? What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?

No, he probably wasn't, since he had not yet because when he came to Jesus, he was curious about what Jesus had to say and had to first understand what being born of the Spirit meant. Therefore, he most likely wasn't already born of the Spirit.

People who have experienced the second birth can spiritually discern and enter the Kingdom of God.

[MyRockOfAges]

When Nicodemus came to Jesus, he was a serious seeker of truth but not born of the Spirit. He was teacher of the law but was more curious to know the teachings of the Spirit.

People who have experienced second birth can discern the kingdom of God spiritually as they can see things of the Spirit naturally. Also they can enter the kingdom of God spiritually, i.e to have eternal life. there will be a total change spiritually, change from the inside out and not other way. 

People who have experienced first birth only can not discern the kingdom of God and inherit eternal life. However, they can see the signs and tangible manifestation of Spirit to understand that it is God and to turn to Him.

[newwine50]

Q2. (John 3:1-8) When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit?   No.

What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?

1 Cor 2:12-14 says that the person who is born of the Spirit understands the things of the Spirit.  The person who has not been born again of the Spirit does not understand the things of the Spirit.

"What we have received is not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, so that we may understand what God has freely given us. This is what we speak, not in words taught us by human wisdom but in words taught by the Spirit, explaining spiritual realities with Spirit-taught words.  The person without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God but considers them foolishness, and cannot understand them because they are discerned only through the Spirit." (1 Cor. 2:12-14)

In John 3:10, Jesus asked Nicodemus,  "You are Israel's teacher and do you not understand these things?"  Nicodemus was a teacher of the law but he didn't undrstand the things of the Spirit because he had not bee born again by the Spirit. 
 

[Queen Mc Daniel]

Q2. (John 3:1-8) When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit?

No. The Holy Spirit had not yet come because Jesus was still with His disciple. The Holy Spirit came after Jesus,  crucifixion, resurrection and ascension.

 What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?
The  the first birth is fleshly, ""condemn to death, in need of a sin barer and   separated  from the creator."   "The second birth is spiritual, experience the baptizing of the water and the Holy Spirit. They experience, repentant, a change from death to life, salvation, and now able to enter the kingdom of God and have eternal life". (quotes from my 2018 answer)

[MosesSole]

On 7/23/2018 at 1:15 PM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q2. (John 3:1-8) When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit? What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?  I don't think Nicodemus was born of the Spirit because he wouldn't have been asking about it. I think people who are born again know that there has been a spiritual awakening in them, so if they are actively seeking God's spirit, through baptisms-- water and/or of the Holy Spirit   

 

[Tholang]

No, and that is why he visited Jesus at night to have quality time with to know about this.

The difference is one received the Holy Spirit from God to support the spirit inside to be able to flow outward to help those near.

[Celia P]

When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit?

No he wasn't.

What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?

There is a change in people who have experienced the second birth. They now understand the things that they did not understand before, namely The Word, Scripture, and the Kingdom of God, the world and the ruler of the world. Our Fathers will, and the desire to be obedient to Him. The desire to reach out to a dying world, to minister to, and help others see the truth and the light, that Jesus Christ is The Way, The Truth and The Life.

Love and Blessings to you all. Xx

[Nana Karlsson]

No because he did not understand what Jesus told him about being born again before one can enter into the Kingdom of God, that is the second birth which is also the spiritual birth.

Just like Nicodemus people who have not experienced the second birth do not understand nor are able to discern the things of the Spirit. They are not saved and do not have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. They are mostly familiar with the things in the natural. These are unbelievers and the Kingdom of God is hidden from them.

People who have experienced the second birth are saved, have the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. They can understand and discern the things of the Spirit.  These are believers in Jesus who have invitation to enter the Kingdom of God.

[Zibuyile]

Q2Nichodemus was not born again when hw went to Jesus

Difference between first birth and second birth 

People experienced first birth are only born by the flesh (natural birth) 

Those experienced second birth  has been born by tbe spirit, having accepted Christ as Lord and saviour

 

[Zibuyile]

Q2Nichodemus was not born again when hw went to Jesus

Difference between first birth and second birth 

People experienced first birth are only born by the flesh (natural birth) 

Those experienced second birth  has been born by tbe spirit, having accepted Christ as Lord and saviour

 

[Zibuyile]

Q2Nichodemus was not born again when hw went to Jesus

Difference between first birth and second birth 

People experienced first birth are only born by the flesh (natural birth) 

Those experienced second birth  has been born by tbe spirit, having accepted Christ as Lord and saviour

 

[Zibuyile]

Q2Nichodemus was not born again when hw went to Jesus

Difference between first birth and second birth 

People experienced first birth are only born by the flesh (natural birth) 

Those experienced second birth  has been born by tbe spirit, having accepted Christ as Lord and saviour

 

[Krissi]

When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit? 

How would we know if the HS was in Nicodemus or if Nicodemus' learning was such that he intellectually, not spiritually, intuited something in Jesus'  messages? I assume that the Holy Spirit entered Nicodemus because his desire to know more about God (a pull that Nicodemus felt) was intentional: only God pulls. I assume, too, that the urge to enter, the desire for God, is also by invitation. Nicodemus had this urge, or so it seems. He wanted to know more. As you put it, entrance into the Kingdom of God "is by invitation only."  He seems to have been invited.

But ... there are secular people who are very curious about spiritual things, and feel an "attraction" to them. Think of all the people who join false religions or do weird things to find God (crystals, come to mind).  They feel something. Some sort of curiosity or pull.  I don't think this is the Holy Spirit.  And, too, are scholars who write about biblical texts who seem to have no spiritual sensitivity or growth -- what caused that curiosity? Is it the same force that makes, say, a person study moss or electrons or human psych? Or, is it the Holy Spirit?  

Sometimes, I wish I knew the end of the story. What happened to Nicodemus?  Did he become a Christian, filled with the Spirit? The fact that he subsidized Jesus' burial suggests his interest in Him continued. Maybe he was in the upper room, or outside of it, when the Holy Spirit fell.  Who knows.

What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?

Invitation. We all have the first physical birth.  Very few are invited for a second spiritual birth.

[Katy]

Q2.Nicodemus was an earnest inquirer at the time he went to see Jesus. Although he was a Pharisee and a teacher of the law he must have realised that something was missing, or maybe he saw in Jesus , a unique , holy and powerful man sent by God, and he wanted to find out more about Him. He was not born of the Spirit yet but was seeking truth.

People who have received second birth have recognised who Jesus is and what He has down for them by dying on the cross. They have also recognised their own sinfulness and their utter dependence on God to save them. They have submitted to God In complete humility and utter dependence on Him. Those who have not experienced these things, are Spiritually dead , they do not see their need for God. They feel self sufficient. They are dead in their sin. 

[Niyonka16]

Q2. (John 3:1-8) When Nicodemus came to Jesus, do you think he was already born of the Spirit?

ANSWER: NO … Nicodemus did not understand what Jesus was saying and thought he had to re-enter his mother’s womb to be born a second time (John 3:4). Jesus was saying to Nicodemus that every person without the outpoured Spirit from above is spiritually dead like the dry bones and cannot even see the Kingdom of God. A person without God’s Holy Spirit is purely “flesh” and has no spiritual eyes, ears or heart to see, hear and comprehend the message that Jesus came to bring. The Lord told Nicodemus unequivocally, “That which is born of the flesh is flesh and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit” (John 3:6). Only the Spirit of the living God can take dry bones, dead in trespasses and rebellion against God, and make them spiritually alive (Ephesians 2:1-5). The Spirit is like the wind that blows wherever he wishes (John 3:8), so we are absolutely dependent on the Holy Spirit to blow upon dead people to make them alive.

What is the difference between people who have experienced the second birth, and those who have only experienced the first birth?

ANSWER: So the first birth necessary to be able to see the kingdom is to be born physically, to be born of water. The second birth that's necessary is to be born of the Spirit. Both are necessary in order to enter in to the kingdom of God. As Jesus says, the only people who will enter God's kingdom are those who are born again, those who have experienced this profound inward change ...

Born again according to John 3:1-8 is: The Holy Spirit gives us faith in Christ and works through the faith we have to give us a new spiritual birth—to change our lives. The Greek word for “again” in “born again” (v3) can also mean “born from above.” You need the Holy Spirit to come down from heaven and turn you into a heaven-bound creature. Jesus explained that this new birth is not physical, but spiritual. The new birth that we must experience in order to “see the kingdom of God”.