Q4. Submission

[Pastor Ralph]

Q4. (Acts 4:19-20) We are told to submit to the civil authorities God has placed over us (Romans 13:1). How are we to balance submission to God with submission to parents and government? How can we be faithful to God and still be humble?

[shaunaduty]

This is hard. I would say "especially in our time," but the reality is, obedience to governments, especially in areas of morality, has always been difficult for people, particularly believers. 

 

I have a drawing that I add to occasionally.  It's  "God bless my home, the USA" with cultural sins named all around it. The first that comes to mind for me is gender confusion in our children. It is culturally acceptable now for individuals to be sensually sinful from a very tender age. We cannot expect a non-Christian culture to be any different, without God.

It is horribly sad, and I have no doubt God's anger is stoked, to see sexual immorality  being presented to children as acceptable. I say, forgive us, Lord!

Forgive the faithful for not doing more to battle te enemy in this, while loving people as you do. We loved and accepted sin instead of leading questioners to you, and now we are reaping that reward: our most vulnerable in society, young children, walking into the arms of sin and rebuking your Law, your good and perfect will that yield the blessings our nation has reaped in the past. Give us the boldness of Jesus, without fear

Of course there's so much more we've failed in. So much more Satan is smiling about. But God wins in the end.

If we rise to love without judging, but with saying, "Jesus loves you and I love you. Period. God's Law says this is a sin. I must stand by that, friend. Let me tell you about my loving God. If you are (or become) a follower of Jesus, then you can question Him directly for answers. I'll be here to help if you need me." 

We must pay our taxes, giving to Caesar what is Cesar's. We must know that God raises up leaders and dethroned them, as well. But we have the vote in America, and while its integrity is sometimes very questionable, we must continue to vote, to elect Christian leaders, to pray fervently and without ceasing for our current leadership, that our nation's morality will be restored from the President to the youth.

It is our responsibility to love, pray, and DO what we can, within the boundaries of God's law and when man's law is not in conflict with God's Law, then we should obey the law of the land to honor God's will.

[Kaleb]

The bible commands us to be submissive to parents, authorities  and those who above us. The bible is the word of God, when God commands us to to something it's for our own good. There's always blessings when we obey the word of God no matter what environment culture or any situation we face.

The important thing here is how do we balance this, it's not easy with our own ability or fleshly efforts. We can only be able by being empowered by the help of the Holy Spirit. Even apostles were able by the empowerment of the Holy Spirit. Therefore we must seek daily intimacy relationship with God to be able to balance being able to obey God and being humble and submissive to authorities.

[Krissi]

We are told to submit to the civil authorities God has placed over us (Romans 13:1). How are we to balance submission to God with submission to parents and government? How can we be faithful to God and still be humble?

Though I will submit to God, I will not submit to human authorities. When God asks me to serve others, I pray to be obedient and submit to His request -- if a political leader tries to coerce me into submission, or demands submission in some manner, I politely refuse. I serve God and God alone. I submit only to God.

Again, my submission is to God alone. Every demand, belief or law passed by the government, (or demanded by my secular family,) is refracted through the prism of faith, prayer and the Bible. If what they are asking is NOT disallowed, I consider it, but I don't obey laws just because the content of these laws are NOT condemned in the Bible. I have a higher standard. Laws must align with what I am sure is God's will. I would not, then, defer to Stalin just because he's a "civil authority" nor will I defer to Biden for the same reason. 

The grey area has to do with deciding what to do with demands and beliefs that are NOT explicitly condemned in the Bible. Slavery was permitted and extolled by the government for many years -- should I have owned slaves? Honest and faithful Christians disagreed with what I consider to be a higher command of equality in the Bible. Obviously slavery is NOT condemned in the Bible. Does that make it right? Do I submit to a government with an economic system and policies built around slavery?

No. I would have fought slavery even though the Bible does not condemn it.

Today, for example, the COVID vaccine, for many of us, is a similar issue. I know several people who were vaccinated simply because the government told them to -- some of them quoted the above Romans verse as pretext. In contrast, I refuse to be vaccinated. I have rational reasons for not being vaccinated that have nothing to do with government edicts, theology or the Bible. On the basis of secular research and reading, I made my decision: I will not permit the government to inject my body.

If the government pins me down and forcibly injects me, I'll pray to be protected from this evil act. If the government gives me no choice but to have it, yet doesn't coerce my submission, I'd rather go to prison and face the consequences of civil disobedience than allow them to inject me with their vaccine.

This brings up all sorts of questions about legitimacy -- when are government edicts/laws legitimate and when are they illegitimate. For me -- and I sense that Pastor Ralph would adamantly disagree -- any law that is contrary to scripture, hurts citizens, abrogates or hinders religious freedom or worship, and demands my acquiescence to what I consider to be evil (supporting abortion, inoculations or slavery, for example), is illegitimate.

I will NEVER submit to such laws. I will actively oppose these laws. I feel it is my Christian duty and obligation to protect innocent people from the government. 

Civil disobedience is the price I choose to pay for not submitting to this government. 

--

I do believe that God's grace (prevenient) extends to human institutions, but don't believe that the biblical command to submit should be interpreted in the flat way you're suggesting. Civil disobedience is a form of submission to the government. It's how we push back against the evil of government coercion. We are NOT told to submit to evil in all it's forms, including contemporary governments. We are to battle evil as Christians, with the spiritual weaponry available to us. 

 

[Katy]

Q4.We should submit to our parents and government only if what they ask is not forbidden in the Bible. If it is forbidden by God then we must walk away and refuse to obey no matter what the consequences may be. If we are walking with the Lord closely, we know that  pride is a sin and God wants us to be like Him especially humble like Him. We cannot really make ourselves humble it is something that happens as we walk with God and realise how sinful we are in the light of God’s righteousness and sinless ways. Therefore I think as we serve God faithfully we gradually become humble.

[LaurenC]

KRISSI brings us interesting points on civil disobedience in light of scripture. Our study question is quiet wide. On the other hand I see our text of Peter before the Sanhedrin, refusing to obey men rather than God is in context of evangelism. But as citizens what should be our attitude? What does God require of us? From Micah 6:8 “ to act justly, show kindness ( love faithfulness) and walk humbly with your Lord.”

If I want to build a fence around my house, I must submit to local government laws. My neighbors must be consulted so that I do not interfere with their “amenity”. There must be thousands more little restrictions I must adhere to, for community harmony. My rights of freedom are restricted by my responsibility to others.

I am personally prepared to submit to government health orders not just to protect my own health but to protect vulnerable members of my community. Recent survey of my church as we come out of lockdown, found 60% of us said we should comply with mandatory vaccination requirements to protect the vulnerable. A further 30% thought people should not be excluded from church because they chose not to vaccinate. I Should clarify 90 % of my state in Australia will be double vaccinated by 18th Oct and we are generally more accepting of being regulated than USA.

While I respect Krissi’s right to her decisions, I just present another cultural viewpoint. I wonder how much are we reflecting our own cultural norms? But even if Australians agree to protect each other in this way from covid, we are slack in rejecting state laws that fail to protect the life of the vulnerable unborn and frail aged.

[haar]

Q4. (Acts 4:19-20) We are told to submit to the civil authorities God has placed over us (Romans 13:1). How are we to balance submission to God with submission to parents and government?

Our decision should be based on whether the order from the authority contravenes God’s order. If it does, our response should be same as that of Peter and john- to obey God rather than man.

How can we be faithful to God and still be humble?
By ensuring we give respect,  honour and respect to those in authority as long as we do anything that will cause us to sin against the King of Kings.

[Old Jerry]

The reason to study that bible is to know what God’s commands are. So we are to submit to civil authorities but we must not to disobey God. So if there is a conflict then we may have to suffer from the civil authorities. We can still be faithful to God and still be humble.

[Irmela]

Q4. (Acts 4:19-20)

We are told to submit to the civil authorities God has placed over us (Romans 13:1).

How are we to balance submission to God with submission to parents and government?

How can we be faithful to God and still be humble?

We have two-fold citizenship. In heaven and here on earth.   First responsibility is to our Lord in heaven.  Allegiance of the Christian is to God, and his relationship to the government on earth is submission. Should the government expect something of us which is against what God has shown us to live and be like , then we are certainly without a doubt to submit to God.     eg.,  Abortion is cruel; it is first degree murder of an innocent human being.  Some governments allows this and in cases even make it a law that only a certain amount of children are allowed in the family, if an added child is expected, it is to be killed.   

I guess only once we are in the situation can we also honestly say how we would react to certain rules and regulations.  like eg., in the war where people were not given up but hidden in houses to escape from certain death. Their whereabouts were hidden from government officials as good as possible and an escape route sought to get them to freedom.  It was going against regulations, but surly God saw what was going on.  

[crissy464]

We have to choose to submit to God for the process of learning in order to grow spiritually. It is a process begun at salvation and ongoing with each and every choice that we make to submit ourselves to God. This process will continue until the Lord comes again or He calls us home. The wonderful thing about this is that, as the Apostle Paul so aptly states, "But we all, with unveiled face beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the spirit of the Lord"
         
        To be humble, we must believe that God will lead us in the best way to live and avoid temptation. We must put complete trust in the Lord and not deceive ourselves with vanity or ****. We should lean on God's understanding, wisdom, and divinity to show us the righteous path through prayer, meditation, fasting, and other faithful practices.