Q2. Bad Behaviors

[Pastor Ralph]

Q2. (Titus 2:2-3) What seem to be the predominant sins of the older men and women in the churches of Crete? What specific behaviors does Paul urge in place of these sins?

[Krissi]

Most Mideastern cultures have wine as a regular drink, much like we drink coffee, tea and perhaps beer in America. It has been pointed out that wine is a "safe" and portable drink in places where water is scarce or impure, which may have been the case at that time, but I don't know. Obviously, over-drinking and alcoholism were big problems in the early church -- cultural behaviors that the new converts brought with them to their faith. Essentially, Paul calls them to live a higher, more moral and god-fearing existence. His commands to the men and women, particularly the older ones who should be modeling godliness to the younger, were generic truths.

This leads me to think about behaviors we bring to faith, which are culturally acceptable but not godly or self-disciplined.

1. The studies we've done on materialism obviously speak to a cultural difference we should have v. the prevailing culture, but what else?

2. For many, the Internet is a huge temptation and problem, partiularly social media. I don't go on social media, but I do check foreign news sites regularly to get both sides of an issue, such as the war between the West and Russia taking place in Ukraine, and the war between Israel/America and the Palestinians/Muslims in Gaza. I probably spent too much time doing this. The Internet, fascinating as it is, is also a time-waster.

3. As a woman, **** is not interesting to me, but I know of many men who are addicted to sexual sins of this nature -- this is a cultural behavior that is unacceptable to the church for obvious reasons.

4. I live in a state that has legalized most drugs. The impact that it's had on this state is obvious, though I question whether it is the role of the government to determine the behavior of citizens. The church should be actively teaching Christians to not take drugs, get drunk, etc. We should teach our own to have a higher standard, not a equal one. 

5. Overeating or gluttony is a sin that is totally overlooked in most churches. If Christians were thin, trim and healthy, our behavior would be a testimony to self-discipline in the church. But, in most churches, Christians look like the people around them. We don't stand out as different, but are just as fat and out of shape. If you look at photographs and movies of the West in the 1950s, for example, most of us were thin. Wouldn't it be a wonderful witness to the culture to undeniably look healthier and thinner than seculars, to "show off" our self-discipline in this regard, to look like we did a few generations ago?

6. For that matter, Christians should be healthy and healed. If we say God heals, but are as sick and ill as those around us, our words are shallow and faithless. Either God heals us or He doesn't, and if He heals us that this should be statistically obvious. Are Christians healthier than seculars? If not, why not?

7. Regarding children's education, Christian schools should be not only academically superior (because of our self-discipline, not native abilities) as well as lovely places to raise children when compared to government-run schools. We should stand out, and in many ways, I think we succeed at this. Ditto with homeschooling families. Our children should be superior in every way to secular children who have been herded into public institutions and, frankly, there abused intellectually and morally.

8. Also divorce. I am divorced and thus know it to be a tragedy -- I am in no position to critique the church in this regard. It's a horrible thing to be divorced. A huge black stain. I have moved on after being forgiven and healed, but the impact of my divorce radiates to my children and others. Divorce should be much more rare in the church. Accountability groups that meet over a long period of time composed of four or five people who are open and honest with each other may help -- perhaps knowing each other better would lower the divorce rate among us. We really have a long way to go.

To sum: Paul, in these passages, is calling us to live differently than the prevailing culture, to live according to Christian values and norms. We should stand out as different, to be obviously superior, morally and in the way we treat each other and in our self-disciplined lives. Any secular person looking at us from outside the church should immediately see the difference. 

[Dr. Gracie L. Adderly]

The purpose for Paul leaving Titus behind in Crete was to straighten out the mess that was left unfinished. Many claimed to know God, but by their actions they denied Him. They were detestable, disobedient and unfit for doing anything good. Titus was to encourage traits such as faithfulness, respectfulness, dignity, and self-control. Older men and women were to mentor younger men and women, respectively.

 In the same way, older women were to be reverent in behavior, not gossipers, or drinking in excess. They were to demonstrate and teach what was good. 

 

[Eldress Rowe]

The predominant sins of the older men and women in Churches of Crete were they were not watchful of their conduct and conversation.  Their behavior, speech and dress were unbecoming of aged persons and they were not even temperate in their eating and drinking.  The aged women were not behaving as holy women sanctified by the Spirit of god for their clothing, speech, conduct, nor conversation was representative of such. They were false accusers and given to much wine.

Paul told them that even if their bodies were unhealthy they should be sound in their minds and in the doctrine of their faith.  Their faith in Christ should appear to be right and genuine and their love to God, Christ, and His people should be real and sincere and not on the things of the world.  The women should be teacher of good thing both by example and instructions both in their own houses as well as publicly.  They were not to teach superstitious customs, rites, and ceremonies but things that were solid and substantial, useful and inspiring, honest and honorable, chaste and pure.  In order word they were to teach the Word of God and the doctrines of Jesus Christ.

[Niyonka16]

Q2. (Titus 2:2-3) What seem to be the predominant sins of the older men and women in the churches of Crete?

ANSWER: The predominant sins of the older men and women in the churches of Crete is older men in the congregation should be taught how to behave. Also the older men can drink too much bringing disrespect on themselves and, by extension on the whole Christian community of which they are a part. Likewise, the older women were to be taught reverent in the way they live, not to be slanderers or addicted to much wine, but to teach what is good.

What specific behaviors does Paul urge in place of these sins?

ANSWER: The specific behaviors Paul urges in place of those sins are the older men were to be taught temperance, respectable, self-controlled, and sound in faith, in love, and in endurance. (Older men are to be temperate, dignified, self-controlled, sound in faith, in love, and in endurance.)

The older women were to be taught reverent in behavior, not "slanderers“, temperate, and teachers of what is good. The older women can and should be examples to and instructors of the younger women in the church. (Older women likewise are to exhibit behavior fitting for those who are holy, not slandering, not slaves to excessive drinking, but teaching what is good. In this way they will train the younger women to love their husbands, to love their children, to be self-controlled, pure, fulfilling their duties at home…)

[t-c]

Q2. (Titus 2:2-3) What seem to be the predominant sins of the older men and women in the churches of Crete? What specific behaviors does Paul urge in place of these sins?

It seems as if Paul was telling Timothy that the older men need to grow up spiritually. The things that he mentions are issues that a newer Christian might be dealing with. These men were to be examples for younger men to follow. The sins these men exhibited are excessive wine consumption, lacking wisdom, credibility, faith, love and perseverance. The women on the other hand were dealing with irreverent behavior, gossip, excessive wine consumption and lack of sound teaching.

For the men, Paul, suggest that they should be temperate, dignified, sensible, sound in faith, in love, in perseverance.

For the women Paul suggests for them to be reverent in their behavior, not malicious gossips, nor enslave to much wine, teaching what is good.

 

[haar]

Q2. (Titus 2:2-3) What seem to be the predominant sins of the older men and women in the churches of Crete? What specific behaviors does Paul urge in place of these sins?

A2.

I think the predominant sin of the older men and women in the Churches of Crete was drunkenness. This was a serious sin as it could lead to sins and misbehavior which could could tarnish the the name of the Church and the name of God and thus bring disrespect to the Church as well as to God .

Paul urged that these men and women should be temperate, respectable, self-controlled etc.

nk

[Diane D.]

There appears to be a number of older men and women who are intemperate.  As well, their behaviour is not worthy of being a member of the Christian community through their lack of control, gossip and slander.  Paul wants to see these followers with patience and self-control, moderate in the way they drink, honorable in their actions and examples of moral values to their households and communities.

[Katy]

Q2. The older men were to be taught by Titus to be first and foremost Temperate. It appears that the older men were drinking too much alcohol and this was affecting the way people thought about them and of course the church. Paul urges Titus to teach them to be worthy of respect. Respect must be earned and of course if they are consuming too much alcohol, they will not earn any respect. The old men must also learn about self control, which is very much needed if they are going to limit their intake of alcohol. The old men must also ensure they are taught about the soundness or healthy Christian virtues of agape love, sound doctrine, which needs study and application to God’s word on a regular basis. They must also be taught the importance of being patient and enduring whatever comes their way.

It appears that the older ladies may have been indulging in too much wine. This of course will have led to behaviour that was displeasing to God. Titus must teach the older women the importance of living in a reverent way, a way that would please the Lord. There is no place for uncouth and coarse behaviour in a Christian women’s life. We must be good examples to the younger generation of women coming after us. The older women have a role to play in teaching what is good , and to know what is good needs prayer and study of God’s word. 

[Clelie]

Older men and women in Crete are likely to drink too much wine . When they are drunk they became the laughing stock and thus malign the name of God. 
Women tend to gossip that  often bring ill feelings and division in the church .

Paul exhorts Titus to teach the older men and women  to live such life that brings respect I be temperate, sober , sound in faith, in love and endurance.
Older women to be reverent in  the way they live , to be sober and cause younger women to respect them., not to gossip and slander but to be godly example to the younger women .They then can teach younger Women to respect their husbands and love their children 

 

[Nicolaas A.P. Mostert]

Q2. (Titus 2:2-3)

What seem to be the predominant sins of the older men and women in the churches of Crete?

Rebelliousness and deception was characteristic of residents of Crete.

Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, lazy gluttons.

What specific behaviors does Paul urge in place of these sins?

A conscience to be restored by deep repentance and reeducation from the Word of God,.

Those who have lost a sense of right and wrong must take the time to listen and absorb God's truth.

[Jonathan Edwards]

Basically they were getting involved in behaviors unbecoming for new converts.  They were getting involved in idle chatter and wasting time in things that were not properly Christian.  In pagan Cretan culture men were used to various pagan gatherings: involvement with alcohol and drinking parties.   The ladies too had to renounce heterodox agendas and stop being busybodies.  Titus had a serious mission to further catechize the congregants:  those who were baptized in Christ have put on Christ;  they have been given their baptismal robes.  They now have to glorify God by their new lifestyles: working with their hands, no more pagan drinking parties, no more spending time in idle chatter.  Spiritual formation in the home is crucial.   Young people needed to see the wonderful changes in the lives of their parents.

[hanks]

Q2. (TITUS 2:2-3) 
What seem to be the predominant sins of the older men and women in the churches of Crete? What specific behaviours does Paul urge in place of these sins? 
Older men drank too much, bringing disrespect upon themselves as well as the congregation. They did not act with proper seriousness or dignity; often being carried away by carnal desires and hysterical excitement – showing signs of immaturity. The older women as well needed to behave with dignity, not slanderers, not addicted to much wine, to be teachers of what is good. The apostle also refers to their conduct and overall behaviour, to the entire appearance of the older women. Both older men and older women should display the characteristics of maturity in their behaviour. Older men are to be temperate, worthy of respect, and self-controlled. They should be sensible, using sound common sense in all situations in which they might find themselves. They must show firmness of character, making them reliable and trustworthy at all times. Older women are also to live lives of respect, to control their gossiping as well as their wine consumption, and being a good example to younger women. This mature behaviour should be complemented by godliness, displaying the Christian virtues of faith, love, and endurance. In faith by placing their trust not upon their feelings, but upon the eternal and unchangeable Word of God. In love by letting all their good works be to the glory of our Lord, and not striving for recognition of others. In endurance, the willingness to be faithful also in the midst of persecutions and afflictions. Living in a pagan world this is easier said than done. We need the Holy Spirit to give us the wisdom and discernment we need, and the fruit of self-control to control our wills, tongues, and passions, so that we do not dishonour our Lord Jesus Christ. 
 

[Old Jerry]

It seems that the predominant sin of the older men and women was drinking to much wine. They are to be taught to be reverent in the way they live, not to be slanderers or addicted to much wine, but to teach what is good.