Pastor Ralph Posted August 25, 2006 Report Share Posted August 25, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandrocksam Posted September 11, 2006 Report Share Posted September 11, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? To me, predestination means that God has a plan for us personnaly but it is dependant on our accepting Christ and following where he leads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? There is nothing scary about predestination, (except when misconstrued as an eradication of the free will) in fact, it is very comforting. That is why Paul is praising for it in the "hearing" of Ephesians. But why did Paul bring it up? It is in keeping with its purpose, as F.F. Bruce says "The Letter was written to encourage Gentile Christians to appreciate the dignity of their calling, with its implication not only for their heavenly origin and destiny, but also for their present conduct on earth, as those who were heirs of God, sealed with the Holy Spirit." I would like to suggest also that predestination be discussed in the light of grace and love, because it was in love that God chose his people before the world's foundation through Christ. And we so undeserve it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chukwuemeka Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Hi! I am Chukwuemeka from Nigeria. Predestination is only God's plan for those who will believe in Christ. The Word of God says "...that whosoever believes in Christ will not perish, but have eternal life." Anyone who enjoys the conviction the taeching of Christ gives is part of the divine plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pickledilly Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 To most people, I think the concept of predestination is scary in that it seems to imply that God creates some for salvation and some for destruction. It seems to discredit the God-ordained right to choose by self-will. I can't reconcile that view of predestination with the LORD's own words, "whosoever will". This is one of those issues where we just have to trust that God is God, whether we can explain things or not. His thoughts and ways are higher than ours, thank heaven! (Isa.55:8-9) And they can always be trusted because He is love and good (Psa.100:5). I think this is actually a comforting reminder that the plan of redemption was fully prepared and unchangeably determined, thus predestined, before He ever spoke that first word of "Let there be…" The Church was planned and prepared for development even before the foundations of the world were created. I think Paul brought up the issue to explain and assure that it is only by God's timeless sovereign will that we (the Church) have been integrated with Christ to receive every spiritual blessing with Him in heavenly places. When we receive the salvation provided by Christ's blood, the LORD lovingly adopts us as His own. This wasn't some new plan He came up with after things got going. I think the very purpose of the world was to bring this Bride into existence for the glory of Christ! The Ephesian church, with all of the pagan influences we read about in the introduction to this study, must have been way off base in their understanding of who a believer in Christ really is. God sees us now as holy and blameless, already positioned in heavenly places with spiritual blessings. They must have been errant in their understanding of who Sovereign Yahweh really is and what His purposes are in uniting us with Christ. We don't choose God and His holiness so much as He came looking for us as degenerate sinners and He has chosen us. We are purposed for His glory, not Him for ours (even though we gain His glory in Christ). They must have been confused in their understanding of what the Church really is. The Church is not of our making. It is comprised of those God has chosen because they have received the salvation of Christ. This should never become a reason for pride, but in truth should be utterly humbling. It's all about God, not us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KathyK Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? Here is what is scary...had not God sought me while I was a sinner, I would still be lost to sin. But by His grace and love I am part of His will and to be used for His glory. I can't even grasp it! But I sure am thankful for it! It is encouraging to know that you are part of something greater than yourself...and to be a part of God's plan...nothing is greater than that. Paul knows that upon them "hearing" they are part of God's plan...he must love them and therefore is thankful to God for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve ring Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? Nothing is scary about predistination, but it is very comforting to know that God knew everything that was and is going to happen even before it happens. As the Old Testiment say's " I knew you before you were in your mothers womb". God knew us before we were even known to our own family, He knew what we were going to be and who. I think Paul brought this up because he wanted to let the Ephesians to know that God had a purpose in their lives, even before they knew about Jesus, and that He is now carrying out that purpose. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCSupSvc Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I don't think there is anything scary about predestination. It is comforting to me to know that before time existed, God chose me to do his work and to spend eternity with him in heaven. Paul brought up predestination to remind the Gentile Christians that God was not just the God of the Jews, but that He had chosen them also. That He had done it long before they were born. In His eyes, they were no different that the Jewish Christians. Paul praised God in their "hearing" so that they would remain strong in their faith, that when trials would come, they would always remember that God chose them and whatever happened to them was within God's plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken7 Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Predestination might be scary if God was as faithful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandralee Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 The scary part is we are ALL predestined! That realization takes away any pride in our role or place in it. God was the sole source of predestination. Paul is praising God for it (predestination)in the Ephesians hearing for they, too, were destined and the proper response is thankfulness and praising in the midst of the predestined. All thought of not belonging, not being chosen was stripped away for God had predestined ALL before the creation of the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 I don't find predestination scary. I like the idea of having been "decide(d) upon beforehand". I like the idea of someone ( God) planning for me, creating me , electing me and living with me because He wanted to (His will). Some people argue it (predestination) leaves no room for choice but if He chose me than He wouldn't be dictatorial and leave me no choice. There's plenty of choosing left to do on our part..Choose to believe, follow, live for... or not. Predestination just means He had a plan and I am/we are part of it! I don't know why Paul would bring it up except as a comfort to the Gentiles b/c the Israelites/Jews were always considered the "chosen ones" and I think Paul is trying to break down any wall of exclusion ...not leaving any room for the Gentiles to say we don't belong or the reverse for the Isrealites to say you don't belong. Kind of like putting us all on the same side... Perhaps Paul praised God for it in front of the Ephesians so they would also extend the blessing(s) to other Gentiles not of Ephesian background. Also because He was a Jew and wanted them to know He accepted them and was glad God included them in the blessings through Christ Jesus. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jules Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Paul praised God in their "hearing" so that they would remain strong in their faith, that when trials would come, they would always remember that God chose them and whatever happened to them was within God's plan. Perhaps this is why predestination is a comfort for us as well...thanks JC for the reminder to us modern day Ephesians! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sgt_Z_Squad Posted September 16, 2006 Report Share Posted September 16, 2006 Q2a. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? Q2a.) It is beyond our understanding and anything we do not understand, can cause fear in us and the world. Q2b.) What is comforting? Q2b.) It is God's plan and he is in control. Q2c.) Why does Paul bring up predestination? Q2c.) To remind the church, that we are not an accident but a purposeful implementation of God's plan, the salvation of men through Jesus Christ. Q2d.) Why do you think he is praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? Q2d.) To remind them that how special we are to be called by God to be His child and to answer His call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Touchpoint Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 Another way to look at predestination is this: In His infinite wisdom, God knows who will accept His offer of grace and mercy, and who will not. But He still offers it to everyone. No one will be able to say they were never given a chance to accept or reject salvation. But those who accept Christ as Savior and Lord, are 'predestined' to be conformed to the image of Christ. It is a lifetime project. We may willingly accept it anf 'enjoy the ride' or fight it, but we will become like Christ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gail Francis Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 To me, predestination means that God has a plan for us personnaly but it is dependant on our accepting Christ and following where he leads. What is scary I would probably say is sometimes how things are planned out for us, we don't even know what is ahead Comforting would be that God care for us before we where even borned and that much love is very comforting, because no one loves us that way, Praise God for His love That it's know accident --God knows all thing and planned it for us through Jesus Christ that we would be free from our sins We praise God for what he has done for us,and for Jesus giving His life for us, and that he loves us so much that He willing gave His son and Jesus gave up His life for our ftreedom of sins, our salvation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kay71 Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 Predestination is scary because you don't know what is going to happen. Predestination is comforting in that God has a plan. As long as you choose the right way, you will be included in that plan. I think he brought predestination up to the Ephesians because he wanted them to know that they were part of God's plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eudora Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? I believe it is the purpose to everyone to consider why they were chosen, not that they were chosen. Why would one consider it scary to be chosen of God. Does He appear to be unloving? Does He seem so far off that just because we can not see Him that He really isn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
may121 Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 Predestination is scary if we would look into the case of Judas Iscariot, having walked with Jesus & witnessed His power, was predestined to destruction by ownself, he chosed this path. I personally don't understand why he had chosen this, money is so big that it has blinded his eyes & influence his decision in betraying Jesus. If we would just trust Him completely or start to trust Him with a small faith (as small as a mustard seed, Bible says) it is not scary, no matter what stormy & crippling condition are we in. Perfect love casts out fear. Know that God is in control, He has a plan to prosper us & not to harm us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jezemeg Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 What is scary about predestination? That God is fully aware that there will be many who will refuse His invitation to join His kingdom, no matter how many times they hear the Good News. The comfort is knowing that I and many of my friends will be together when the time comes for God to call us Home, and be reunited with those who have gone before. While I'm not scared of dying (doctors have assured me for over a decade now that I shouldn't be alive), I'm content to wait til God calls me Home, but at the same time, I'm not going to hang around for a second calling when the time comes either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisa Rupert Posted September 17, 2006 Report Share Posted September 17, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? I am sure predestination can be scary for those who do not take The Word seriously. Those who are afraid are this way because they don't believe that some will be excluded from God's grace with no oppourtunity to redo it again. No second chances. They believe they can continue to live a life of sin and believe that when the final day arrives that there will be another chance to get it right, or they may believe that they have time to start following the Word of God they don't have to do it now, they put it off until later. But for those who do believe it is comforting to know that God chose you from the beginning. It is good to know that you are on the right path. Paul brings this up to let the Gentiles know that they are included in God's plan and that God didn't decided to chose them oneday he choose them before the world was created. I believe Paul was praising God because he was thanking God for predestination. He was giving thanks that God for he chose and he knows who his chosen are and they aren't just a few select people. The Gentiles are included also, all God's people are included no one select group of people but the choice was made throughout all of God's creation of man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helenmm Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? I don't find predestination scary, but rather comforting. I believe God is not willing that any should die but that men need to opt into his plan for them to live. The only scary factor is that many do not know about this option, and we have the responsibility to proclaim the gospel or their blood is on us! That is scary! Paul is very excited about what it is that God has prepared for us. He sees God's goodness abounding toward us (v 8), and the astounding joy that we can know the mystery of His will which is absolutely wild. Every human being is able to receive this abundance and enter into God's great plan, and be saved from the miserable consequences of sin into the unimaginable things that he has prepared for us - the whole width, length, depth and height of them. This is the whole plan and reason that Jesus came in human form. This is the great experience of living on earth - to know God! Once upon a time God lit up Paul's life on a Damascus road. As a lit up man, Paul cannot keep quiet about the wonderful plan and provision of God the Father in Yeshua His Son. His excitement is always on the boil and no-one can take that from him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonS Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 What is scary about predestination? Well it means that we are not in control. We humans want to be in control. It may mean that our prayers for people to be saved have no effect. What is comforting? The all knowing God is in control, and all thing will be done for the good of the Kingdom. Why does Paul bring up predestination? I am not sure but just maybe he wants us to look at life differently. What if everthing that happens is recorded, like on a old 16mm file strip. Everything from eternity past to eternity furture. We just get to see time through a viewer that is for the very second that it is happening. God see it all, what happened, yesterday the same as what will happen tomarrow. Dose that mean what we do don"t matter. I don't think so. Matthew 7:14 small is the gate and narrow is the path that leads to life(eternial) We must find that narrow gate and be saved and then we must walk the narrow path with great care and with our eye on Jesus( the perfector of our faith). For if the path is narrow and we could fall off. When you fall off and don't ask Jesus for help to get back on (repent of your sin) you destination is hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TennLady01 Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? We are not in control of all that is going on around us and then so many times others make us feel we have no way of knowing what to do because we are not in control. What is comforting? The comforting part comes when we know whom we belong too and that is more than able to take care of us his children. When we are in a relationship with our Lord and Savior we find comfort in the fact that he watch's out for us. Why does Paul bring up predestination? Because it makes us think as I am sure it did them also as they read the words and applied them to their lives as we must do ourselves today. He wanted them to know they did not choose God but that he choose them. When we look at things in the big picture of life we are not the ones that are in control but we serve a God that is in control at all times and knows what is going on and when it will happen. He knows all things he is the Alpha and Omega the Beginning and the End. He is The Great I AM. Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? He is praising God because he is glad that they know that God is in control and that they are in a relationship with God the Father because of the Son. He knows that the secret is out and that the gentiles will now believes and understand that the salvation plan is for all not just for a few. God loves us all and we all need to keep praising him because he is the Lord of our lives and we should be thanking and praising him every day for the many blessings he has given us. I know I thank him for choosing me and helping me to understand and hold to him so that I will one day be with him forever. Praise the Lord. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
studying_His_Word Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? What is scary about predestination is that we are NOT in control. What is comforting about predestination is that we are NOT in control!! Truly, to know that God is at the wheel sure gives me a sigh of relief, it takes the pressure off to know that I don't need to spin my wheels trying to make things work out as I think they should - for God has THE plan - the ONLY plan that works for all of us! It may be that Paul is bringing up predestination to provide encouragement to the Ephesian Church as being part of God's plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted September 18, 2006 Report Share Posted September 18, 2006 Q2. (Ephesians 1:4-5) What is scary about predestination? What is comforting? Why does Paul bring up predestination? Why do you think he praising God for it in the "hearing" of the Ephesians? I guess what scares me about predestination is that even though God already knew who would accept and reject Him, and He predestined those whom he knew would accept Him, that it is not done by us. God choses us. It scares me b/c there are people that I love and care about whom I want them to be saved but they will not be and spend eternity in hell. It is comforting because I know God doesn't make mistakes. He knows who will ultimately accept and reject Him. And whom God has predestined to be saved WILL BE SAVED. I think Paul bring it up to show that God knows all things, that it is God's will, God is in control and that God loves us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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