Q40. Pastors and Teachers

[meandean]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

i would look at the life of stephen. heres a guy who helped the needy did all the small jobs under the apostles,went through hours to make sure noone was overlooked, yet when it came to speak... whammo, stephen had the ammo! you know there are times when the pastor has lost my attention in the study. i just don't want a bunch of information, ya know? i can get bits here and there, but for the most part,i'm better off reading and praying on my own. i believe that the heart of the pastor is so compassionate for jesus and it would hurt deeply to tell a senior pastor though we appreciate your time and effort,this really isn't for you. acceptance is what we all crave and this could go either way. the holy spirit gives the gifts as well as the comfort. so the word of god must come before any loyalty or feelings.

[pickledilly]

God can use anyone He wants to, with or without an official title! There are many people with spiritual gifting as pastor or teacher who are not employed on a church staff. As important as it is to have a spiritual "head" in the local congregation, many other areas of need require individuals to lead, keep watch over, and instruct the people. My church has a senior pastor, a worship pastor, a discipleship pastor, a Christian education pastor, a student ministries pastor, an evangelism/outreach pastor, a Spanish ministries pastor as well as people who oversee preschool and children's ministries. They provide overall vision, direction, and cohesive ministry efforts. But then we have the multitudes of volunteers who lead committees, programs, Bible studies and Sunday morning classes, and local ministries to people in need. How could a church survive without the additional people who have spiritual gifts of pastor or teacher but not an official position?!

Only the Holy Spirit gives spiritual gifts. In 1 Corinthians14, Paul indicates that we can pray for particular gifts, but the decision is not ours to make. If we find our senior pastor or church staff lacking, we need to commit to prayer for co-laborers who have strong spiritual gifts in the areas of our need. Perhaps we should begin by seeking those in our midst who are already gifted to assist in the work and leadership.

[edler]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

no other office is given so much instruction in the New Testament as is the pastoral office.I am convinced that the pastor ought to be equipped with the word of wisdom the woed of knowledge and even with tongues and interpretation. there is not a higher more needed office that God could call you to than the office of pastor. it is a noble cause.

[JanMary]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church?

This person could have been given the gift of pastor or teacher, and not as yet been called to a particular place of ministry in a church. It may be that Sunday school or Bible study leaders have this gift. The elderly woman who mentored me when I was a new Christian had both gifts, and was the Prayer minister in the church, shepherding and teaching those of us learning to pray and giving leadership to the entire group.

What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor?

We were in a church in the past, new believers lacking wisdom, where this was the case....at one point he admitted "I am not a compassionate man"...then we noticed how neglected the "sheep" were, and we experienced spiritual abuse at his hands and left the church. One would hope that if it were a good and godly pastor lacking the gift of pastor, that he/she would surround him/herself with shepherds in the form of Elders and Deacons to fill that roll.

Who gives these gifts?

The Lord gives them to each one as He decides.

[hanks]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11)

How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church?

What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor?

Who gives these gifts?

I feel this occurs at most churches. There are specially gifted people who have been given the gift of caring for the spiritual needs of others, and they are not pastors. I was a member of a church were the pastor was more of a teacher and the elders had to take over the duties of a pastor. This only lasted for about two years and the pastor eventually left to go into a different ministry where he was more of an administrator. We received excellent teaching and the elders coped very well, but yet the church was not functioning as it should have. I feel the Holy Spirit is the one that gives special gifts to each one of us; gifts that we can use to glorify our Lord and Saviour.

[RLL]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

First it is the Christ who gives these gifts to us. He is the one who works in and through people with the Holy spirit that He has given us. I believe anyone who allows Christ to work through them by letting Christs light shine is a teacher and there are many people in my church like this but we are gifted with a wonderful pastor who God uses that is very dedicated and puts the church first. God uses people who are in tune with Him and focused on His word whether they are a pastor "officially" or not.

[wifee]

3a) Person may be a housegp leader, Sunday school teacher, pastoral carer etc These are all necessary roles where an official position is not always needed People with gifting for pastoral care can serve God in shepherding of the flock supplementing pastors gifts,if he is more a teacher/leader/overseer etc. c)Lord God through his Spirit gives these gifts to us as needed & as he decides.

[jripper]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

Any one can assume these positions by himself

[Jubilee]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

A person may have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church because it is God that the person serves in this gift.

In a church where the "senoir pastor" does not have the spiritual gift of pastor so much as of faith, leadership, teaching, or administration.

The Holy Spirit is the giver of these gifts.

[Jubilee]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

A person may have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church because it is God that the person serves in this gift.

In a church where the "senior pastor" does not have the spiritual gift of pastor so much as of faith, leadership, teaching, or administration.

The Holy Spirit is the giver of these gifts.

[Old Jerry]

A person can have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in the church. Some of those people operate in the background and are always teaching others and are comforting others. They are that ones that keep the church going. They are the ones that bring love into the church.

If the church has a “senior pastor” that doesn’t have the spiritual gift of a pastor then somebody has to pick up the slack. There is always somebody with that gift in the church and that doesn’t mean he has to be the senior pastor. It is God who gives us these gifts.

[lighthouse2014]

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

Answering the last question first, the gifts of being a pastor, teacher, bishop or musical ministry are given by the Holy Spirit.

A person who excels in these talents or gifts can be called a pastor of it even though he does not carry the title. A senior pastor though he does't have the gift of being a pastor, can still excel in others areas or gifts. He's usually appointed to that position by the church leaders and he is usually the elder of the group.    

[JoanG]

A person may have come into their gifts later in life. Or the person might not fully understand just where his gifts are leading them. And I also feel that the qualifications that a church sets on the titles of pastor or teacher would stop a person from being able to serve in that particular church. these can be the people that do best with street teaching. They find a place in community service programs such as a prison ministry, hospital ministry or other one on this type of situation.

I believe that a church can have more that one pastor to fulfill the teaching and ministries of the church. We might need to look at the gifts of each person and create rolls that fit them. We cannot expect them to fit into our roles.

[Karen11]

On 9/4/2006 at 8:53 AM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q3. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

We do not need to have a position in a church to have the gift of pastor or teacher, there can be other ways to share your gifts.

Pray about it asking the Lord the right way to move.

God gives these gifts.

[hanks]

Q40. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts? 
I feel this occurs at most churches. There are specially gifted people who have been given the gift of caring for the spiritual needs of others, and they are not pastors. I was a member of a church were the pastor was more of a teacher and the elders had to take over the duties of a pastor. This only lasted for about two years and the pastor eventually left to go into a different ministry where he was more of an administrator. We received excellent teaching and the elders coped very well, but yet the church was not functioning as it should have. We needed a pastor. But I still feel that it is teaching which builds up the church. It is teachers who are needed most. Our Lord Jesus through the Holy Spirit is the one that gives special gifts to each one of us; gifts that we can use to glorify our Lord and Saviour. 
 

[haar]

Q40. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

Spiritual gifts are from God. A person may have such gift but does not have an official position in the church. In this case, he should make himself available to the church leaders who can (hopefully) use his gift to build the church. This is more so where the senior pastor does not have such gift himself.
 

[Krissi]

A few things come to mind, here.

1)       Right calling – right place. If a person is called BY GOD to be a pastor, then wouldn’t God also “call” a church for him to lead? I doubt God calls without circumstances validating that call, in other words, if a person is called to be a pastor,  that person would get a church, need to start one, or do non-trad pastoral ministry. The problem to solve would be finding the place where God wants that person to serve Him. Once solved, then the calling and place would both be correct.

2)       Right calling -- wrong place. If the existing churches deny someone’s calling, that person could be called elsewhere.

3)       Right calling – wrong people. Can other Christians or non-Christians derail God’s calling? I wonder how much the exercise of our gifts is contingent on other believers doing their part; our co-labourers, so to speak.

4)       Wrong calling. It could be that the calling was misinterpreted; there was no calling. 

Anecdote: My former church has a pastor who is clearly not in the right place or calling. Social inertia is a strong, strong force, and people continue to come to that church even though it is dying spiritually. Some left, however: the church split. Since the leadership – vestry – of the church did not fire the pastor, which in my opinion should have been done, I believe God in His wisdom separated the spiritually strongest members who subsequently formed a new church.

After watching my church decline, I’m less concerned about an individual having gifts which no one recognizes than I am about an individual NOT having gifts which no one challenges.

My old pastor was absolutely convinced he was called to the pastorate, yet there was no fruit from his years of service. The church he pastored slowly withered until it fragmented. In spite of obvious failure, he’s still there, and still convinced he’s called to be a pastor.

To the contrary, I’ve read about missionaries who labor a lifetime without a single convert. If success/fruit is the proof of calling, we would have to conclude that they weren’t called to evangelize. But, maybe they were planting seeds someone else would harvest in years to come? If so, the fruit may be generations subsequent and it would be difficult to discern between not having a calling and having the fruit delayed.

[Janzie]

On 9/4/2006 at 8:53 AM, Pastor Ralph said:

Q40. (Ephesians 4:11) How could a person have the spiritual gift of pastor or teacher without having an official position in a church? What must a church do if its "senior pastor" doesn't have the spiritual gift of pastor? Who gives these gifts?

The person may have the gift of pastor or teacher but not be recognized yet.  They can start being a janitor, helper, connect group leader, Sunday school teacher and grow into the position, by their obedience in willing to do anything and doing their best as unto the Lord.

If they don't have the gift of Senior Pastor,  then they shouldn't be Senior Pastor.  In our Church you are a Pastor by the call and appointment of God.  After you have proven yourself as a junior Pastor, you can then oversee others in their growth because you have been through the same thing.  You are then qualified to become Senior Pastor.

The Holy Spirit is the giver of these gifts.

[Jonathan Edwards]

William Booth founder of Salvation Army is a prime example, and so is Billy Graham.  Booth did not have a fancy label to denote his calling.  Nor did Billy Sunday nor Charles Finney.   God called this men to be "pastors" in a unique sense; God's ways are not our ways.  I can admit that Rev Billy Graham was my pastor and teacher for many years, as well as Rev Rex Humbard and Rev Oral Roberts.

Booth was a pastor in a sublime sense.   He did not hold a title from his Methodist church.  However, he was a Shepherd of souls of countless peoples in distress.  The Holy Spirit touched his heart to be Shepherd to the most abandoned.  Very similar to St Alphonsus Ligouri in the 18 th century.  Ligouri ministered to the poor Italians in Naples.  He lived a life of extreme humility and profound hRobert's.

I treasure my time when I was in the Full Gospel Businessmen Fellowship and preached at a Salvation Army Corps building here in NYC.   I was a pastor, teacher and evangelist all at once.

[Old Jerry]

An official position in the church has nothing to do with the spiritual gift of a pastor or teacher. It is God who gives them their spiritual gifts, so if the church doesn’t recognize it, it doesn’t make that person’s spiritual gift go away. The church shouldn’t do anything if its “senior pastor” doesn’t have the spiritual gift of pastor. He is probably been given the gift of administration. It is God that gives the gifts.