Q4. Example of Godliness

[nerraw20]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

Rigid orthodoxy cannot produce godliness because it relies on human strenght. A strong example is essential because actions speak louder than words. No matter what you say people will learn more from what you do.

[Richgee]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b)

1. Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not?

A. Because it takes more than just following the rules, Jesus said it well:

Matt 5:21-22a "You have heard that it was said to the people long ago, 'Do not murder, and anyone who murders will be subject to judgment.' 22But I tell you that anyone who is angry with his brother will be subject to judgment.

Israel had a problem; they followed the law but they didn't have it (the law) in their hearts; Jesus was trying to get to the matter before it showed itself. Long before the action has been done, its a thought, long before the action it started in the heart.

2. Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

A. If the leaders didn't show by example then the people would soon follow suit. Paul said follow me as I follow Christ, Jesus showed us that it could be done and the disciples followed that example just as the people follow leadership.

[Jewell]

Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy comes from the head - godliness comes from the heart. It takes what we learn in our head, applied to our heart, a heart filled with love for our Lord, to produce godliness.

Anyone taking a leadership role is looked up to as an example of that which they teach. When that leadership waffles in the church because of indecisiveness or a weak desire to follow our Lord, people take that as acceptable and are prone to pattern their own lives in the same way, creating unhealthy relationships within the church and between the church members and God.

[Mrstoler]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

When a person is rigid and unsmiling, people tend to not what to be around a person like that; because they may feel like the person really doesn

[rayzoe]

Strong leadership in the body of Christ is vital, for the leaders are the pillars of the church without strong support in place the body becomes weak and ineffective. Christ being the head of the church and what holds the head in place is the neck, if the neck is weak it cannot support the head. The head desire is to express himself through the body. Christ was asked one day were does he live? Jesus replied foxes have holes birds of the air have nest but the son of man has nowhere to lay his head. I wonder if Christ was speaking of himself as the head of his body, the body of Christ.

[KWADWO]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

I am of the view that church leaders should not be rigid or unsmiling. Such will not change the attitude of people. People naturely expect to be free and independent and rather guide on the path of truth. Godliness in leaders is what will attract people to God. A strong example of godliness is therefore essential to to a healthy church since that is what people expect.

Thanks.

Collins

[emmaus]

Godliness is produced by love, because God is love. If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am only a resounding gong or a clanging cymbal. Rigid doctrine is about rules. A church needs mature Godly church leaders as examples for the church to carry on untill the Lord comes back.

[prosenstein]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

Rigid orthodoxy cannot produce godliness because it is putting works first before the Spirit.

We need godliness in church leaders who are led by the Spirit in love. Godliness is not just about righteousness but it's also about mercy and love. Justice always needs to be balanced with mercy. Rigid adherence to rules produces a hard judmental character that relies on self rather than God.

[Commissioned]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness because along with right doctrine the characteristics of godliness does not embrace rigidity and a sour disposition. A strong example of godliness in church leaders is essential to a healthy church because the followers are looking for leaders who lead by example.

[rambler]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

Because godliness is seen in love. Because people learn to do what they see in action. As leaders we must not say "do as I say and not as I do". Our words and actions must jive.

[Peggy Crans]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

Actions speak louder than words. We need to have and show a loving and gentle spirit. Being rigid and unsmiling turns people off and discourages them. A strong example of godliness in church leaders is essential to a healthy church because leaders should lead by example. If we lead by world example we don't show the love of Christ.

[debbiemoore]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

you can read and listen to the things of God and not have the spirit with in you so there for you can't produce godliness because if the church leader does not have godliness and the spirit of God in them How can they teach the thing of

god

[wanting]

I once knew someone who had been introduced to God in a very strict way. She turned away the first chance she got and no matter what I said, made no difference. In fact, she told me, "Why would I want to worship an old man waiting to write down everything I do wrong?" I tried so hard to change her mind, to show her the Truth. I told her that is not the Jesus I know. I kept trying, she died alone, and I failed. I hate to think of, well....We should all be very careful of how we teach the young of our families, being mindful of the eyes watching us. Who would want to be a follower of someone who cleans the outside of the cup? What's inside does show.

[suedeboy]

Teaching the right doctrine will not produce godliness.It must produce fruit of the spirit within the congregation.The bible said in Peter 1:22 "you have purified yourself by obeying the truth,so that you have sincere love for your brother,love one another deeply from the heart".This love for one another must be extended to people new to the Church and people outside the Church.This picture of godliness is essential for the leader because the congregation is his flock and they will follow whatever the leader doe.

[DrD]

There must be an inward change as well as the presence and influence of the Spirit of God to produce godliness in a person. . .

Strong examples of godliness in Church leaders is important because people that follow certain people tend to memic their behavior and lifestyle. Righteousness begets righteousness - unrighteous behavior has the same effect. . .

2 Thessalonians 3:6-7 (NKJV)

6 But we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw from every brother who walks disorderly and not according to the tradition which he received from us.

7 For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us, for we were not disorderly among you;

[Barbara A. Lee]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

I dislike cliches but this is one time that one is needed. We, as Christians, need to remember that we lead by example. By this I mean we can't say "Do as I say not as I do". We must lead people like Christ did. By example. If we are going to be looked at as Godliness, the we have to show Godliness. I have a problem with drinking any alcoholic beverages. We are told everything in moderation is ok, but when you have people in Church that are recovering alcoholics, you really need to watch how you say certain things. This is one thing that really bothers me. You cannot have alcohol on your breath when you get an emergency call and have to leave right away. I am sorry, but Ministers need to set the example. If you are out having dinner at a diner, and you have a beer on your table and a member of your church walks by, how are you going to explain the message you gave on drinking when you are doing just the very thing you told them not to do. And, you should watch how you talk too. And tempers need to be tempered. It all leads back to we are what we say, do and think...

[jamjar]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

[jamjar]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

When we have the Holy Spirit living in us our hearts are open to receive others as they are. We do not have a bunch of rules and regulations to be followers of Christ.

A strong example of godliness in a church help a church to grow in all of the gifts of the Holy-Spirit if we see these gifts in leadership we will be drawn to the leadership because he is Christ-like.

[Old Jerry]

Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness because they are looking at just keeping the law. Godliness is going out knowing that God is with you and believing in it and trying to do the things that God wants us to do.

The reason strong examples of godliness in church leaders are essential for a healthy church is that it is easier to follow an example then it is to listen to a sermon.

[Eagleswings01]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness because it is only concerned about rules and laws but godliness is much deeper. Godliness comes from seeking to please God, from submitting as a way of life to the gentle leading of the Holy Spirit, as well as to his occasional rebuke.

A strong example of godliness in church leaders is essential to a healthy church since most people tend to learn by example;that is learn by what they see. "Leaders must not only talk the talk ,but must also be able to walk the walk." Others will observe and eventually follow.

[Kent]

If all one does is strive to obey a strict set of rules and laws, one loses sight of the bogger picture, that of caring for others, and helping others in their daily walk. Strict adherence to a rigid doctrine won't allow time for the little kindnesses we should also be sharing with those around us.

[Craig]

Q4. (1 Timothy 4:12b) Rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy can teach right doctrine, but cannot produce godliness. Why not? Why is a strong example of godliness in church leaders essential to a healthy church?

Rigid orthodoxy is just that -- rigid orthodoxy. It is abstract theology or doctrine. It only becomes alive and living when practiced.

Malcolm Muggeridge wrote: "The religion Jesus gave the world is an experience, not a body of ideas or principles. It is in being lived that it lives." Living out the Word of God produces godliness. As long as the Word of God remains in the mind it means nothing and can produce nothing.

[wifee]

4a)Right doctrine does not produce godlines, because godliness is the fruit of our love for God,our heart,mind&soul response.
b)If we preach godliness but don’t show evidence of it,we lose integrity of what we say,people neglect/dismiss what we say&go their own way.People learn from what they see in action,not just leaders words,they need to feelGod’s love through us.We need to show our need ofGod’s grace &help in this too&demonstrate godliness by diligently persevering at all times with help ofHS,learning as He guides us how to please Him loving others by our actions&thoughts.

[Jonathan Edwards]

It all boils down to having a daily Bible and prayer time.   Timothy caught more bees with honey than with vinegar.   By the way he conducted himself in a sober manner attracted new converts; it was real, not a show.  Timothy was the type of person that even unbelievers we're drawn to.  Despite persecutions, Timothy was truly a light on the hill.  The way he deeply believed, his strong enthusiasm, a deep love for Christ and the Ephesians, and the way he talked.  Indeed, Timothy was an icon--pointing people to Christ by the way he lived.

Rules have a place but they are only guidelines.   All the textbooks on spirituality cannot make a man of prayer.   Like the prophets of old, we have to go up to our own Mt Sinai or the desert to seek the Lord.  The word is mortification. God works on us slowly at times to form into the image of Jesus Christ.  Not an overnight process; as we study the HOLY BIBLE we have the Mind of Christ.

[Krissi]

 Though "rigid, unsmiling orthodoxy" can certainly teach morality and ethical norms as well as "right doctrine," godliness goes beyond behavior to the heart, and I don't see much about the heart in these particular passages of Paul.

I do see Paul telling Timothy to "not neglect your gift," which suggests that Paul views the Holy Spirit as the basis of godliness.

--

We Christians, not just church leaders, should "be diligent ... give wholly" and progress in our Christian live, speech, love, faith and purity. That's a tall order.

It would be helpful to restore a respect for the elderly as older people, after a lifetime of Christian faith, have much to teach and show-by-example younger and middle age Christians. Moral leaders aren't necessarily church leaders. Moral leaders are the those who have been tried and tested repeatedly and found not wanting. They need to step up to the plate and mentor. There are elders and olders. We're talking about olders.

I see two problems.

First, we wrongly associate moral leadership with church leadership instead of age-in-Christ. There are very few Timothys -- young people who are morally mature -- and more ignored, wise old women and men. So we're looking to the wrong people. 

Secondly, older people are used to being shoved to the side (Western churches practically worship young families) so do not assert themselves as moral leaders. The olders of the church need to do their part by claiming their rightful role in the church. I'd love to see a church which overtly and publicly exhorts it's congregation to heed the words the 70s-80s-and-90s members. I'd also love to see the olders in the church "assigned" to mentor a group of younger people, perhaps taking them to coffee weekly or running small accountability groups. 

We have wisdom in our midst but do not avail ourselves of it!